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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 12:29 pm 

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I liked the episodes so far, the last being the best one. It clearly has its own pace and that's something that needs to be applauded. No need for blurry cameras and that sort of shit.

As for the book series, I've read some fantasy but some way or the other I think Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series as the very best there is out there. Maybe I will get into the Song of Fire and Ice series, maybe not.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 1:53 pm 
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If you like the show and read, get the books.

Edit:to the point.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 2:22 pm 
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I do and I did!

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 7:25 pm 

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Tonight's episode should be a good one for Viserys fans if it ends where I think it will.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 8:42 pm 
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Sam and Gendry! You'll see more of them in season 2, not much of a spoiler.

Edit:
That ending sequence is practically verbatim from the book, ends a chapter. Nice to see them using the built in cliffhanger points.

Edit, the second:
Bronn. I missed him the first time. The guy who sold his room to Tyrion at the Inn near the end, Bronn the sellsword, more of him on the way, too.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 2:05 pm 
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For those who read the books (not a spoiler) -

In the books was it Littlefinger who told Sansa the story about The Hound getting fucked up by his brother? I seem to remember it coming more directly from the source, but it's been awhile.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 2:23 pm 
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The Hound himself tells Sansa while he's drunk (seems like after the tournament).

Edit: Sam and Gendry, indeed. Neither looks a damn thing like they're portrayed in the books. Sam, in fact, doesn't even seem to be the same character in total from the book.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 2:25 pm 
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GodShifter wrote:
The Hound himself tells Sansa while he's drunk (seems like after the tournament).


That's what I thought...not sure what necessitated the change, but I hope it's not because The Hound will be given a lesser role than in the books.... one of my favorite characters.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 2:59 pm 
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Right now I'm thinking they might still include the Hound telling her anyway, this would be just a way to sort of pre-confirm it's true (Without ever having Sansa tell anyone), and it sets up Littlefinger's creepy ways some as well. Plus Sandor can be overly drunk and slurry and everyone will know what he's saying and what it means that he's willing to tell Sansa. I think the importance of it would be lessened if we didn't know that so few people knew how he got his scars.

It's not a long involved story, so telling it twice wouldn't be that big of a deal.

The Mountain is one of the most monstrous characters in the book. Not just for what he did to his brother. Hell, that's the least of it.

Oh and in case anyone wondered: Ser Hugh's death was not an accident.
GodShifter wrote:

Edit: Sam and Sam, in fact, doesn't even seem to be the same character in total from the book.



How? His reaction to the training is the same, the way he tells the tale of his father, he falters some while in the book he tells it flatly. He is a coward.

Everything I saw was pretty much exactly what was in the book, fat, bookish and scared to death. They'll get to his usefulness.
But everything at the Wall was pretty much how it goes in the book, I think Jon, Green and Pyp threatened more than one of the other brothers with Ghost but the point was made. Jon is a leader, Pyp and Grenn his earliest followers and Sam benefits. And in the end he proves his usefulness.

I'm sure they're not done with Sam, they'll get to his intelligence and place in the Night's Watch. But when he arrived he was almost exactly as he was shown in the show.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 8:41 pm 
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Sam is portrayed as being much fatter in the book. Even far less confident than portrayed on the show (if that's possible). He never, ever professes a liking for women in the book. That's part of his "awakening" (and you know what I'm talking about here, Jam). TV Sam doesn't have the same traits as the character in the book.

Gendry looks zilch like he's described in the book but this seems to be a trend in this series.

Yes, I'm nitpicking.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 9:22 pm 
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Sam's described as 14 stone in the book that's 280lbs. That kid is 230-250 at least. Close enough for me.
There's a couple of scenes with Sam being cowardly in training and Alliser Throne encouraging the trainees to abuse him before Jon starts to step in, the pace of the relationship is sped up for dramatic purposes. I think it works out the same. Same with the bonding scene, it's about moving things faster, not changing anything. It would have taken an entire episode to set it up the way the book did.

My only beef is it isn't clear how much of bibliophile Sam is yet.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 3:54 pm 
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Jam8 wrote:
My only beef is it isn't clear how much of bibliophile Sam is yet.


I think that is probably a symptom of the same compression of pace and story...The viewer has to first look down on Sam, then feel sorry for him, THEN find out he's got some worth to him...in the book that is all woven together nicely through dialogue and exposition, but for the show they have to take a less subtle approach with the supporting cast, I think.

Again, my complaints about the series so far are minor, moreso than I even expected...kudos to the team making it.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 11:44 am 
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JxDx wrote:
Jam8 wrote:
My only beef is it isn't clear how much of bibliophile Sam is yet.


I think that is probably a symptom of the same compression of pace and story...The viewer has to first look down on Sam, then feel sorry for him, THEN find out he's got some worth to him...in the book that is all woven together nicely through dialogue and exposition, but for the show they have to take a less subtle approach with the supporting cast, I think.

Again, my complaints about the series so far are minor, moreso than I even expected...kudos to the team making it.


^^ This is especially true of this last episode. TONS of expository information that is BETTER revealed in the book through it's narrative which TV shows don't have that luxury. So they have to have arbitrary conversations about past events that we'll never see, but yet are still important to future things to come.

But so far (again, only half-way through the second book), I think it's coming out nicely.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 11:48 pm 
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I'm sure it'll be dealt with, it's pretty important that he learns things from the Watch's annals.

I'm not picking nits about this, I have always been able to judge an adaptation for it's form not against it's original.

Everytime I hear someone praise the show I want to say "There's so much more to the books. This is the skeletal framework, the spine of plot, the books are these huge meaty things, fleshy and full of detail."

And it is epic.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 11:43 am 
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Okay, am I not remembering something in the book or is the Loras - Renly connection a little more intimate than it was written?


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 12:23 pm 

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Just finished watching the latest episode... And now I remember why I usually wait until the season (or even entire series) is done before I start to watch it.

Shit just started getting good and now I have to wait an entire week. I prefer to watch shows in batches.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 12:25 pm 
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I'm about 3/4 done with the book. Shit's getting real right and left. Will be interesting to see how it plays out on the screen.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 12:48 pm 
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Arzgarth wrote:
I'm about 3/4 done with the book. Shit's getting real right and left. Will be interesting to see how it plays out on the screen.


If you're at where I'm estimating where you are at, I myself am on pins and needles. Especially to talk about it in this thread because I don't want to spoil anything.

Almost finished with the second, and I totally forgot that Arya saw Varys and Mycelle talking. Wow. This shit is epic.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 1:02 pm 
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Crutch wrote:
Arzgarth wrote:
I'm about 3/4 done with the book. Shit's getting real right and left. Will be interesting to see how it plays out on the screen.


If you're at where I'm estimating where you are at, I myself am on pins and needles. Especially to talk about it in this thread because I don't want to spoil anything.

Almost finished with the second, and I totally forgot that Arya saw Varys and Mycelle talking. Wow. This shit is epic.



Yes, GRRM has a way of bitch-slapping the reader occasionally to make sure you pay attention ;)

One of the reasons I am so beholden to the books, and excited to see how they treat it on the HBO series.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 2:17 pm 
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JxDx wrote:
Okay, am I not remembering something in the book or is the Loras - Renly connection a little more intimate than it was written?


Martin has stated that they were lovers but he never had the chance to fully show it because of his structural choices, neither was a Point Of View character so he could only hint at it, there was no way to show it through other characters given the secrecy of the relationship. It's not like anyone else was in the room. He's been saying this for years as readers asked about the comments made by Stannis and Jaime about their relationship in the books, the most direct references to it.

More recent article where he states it, but similar things were said years before the show:
http://www.afterelton.com/tv/2011/01/ga ... rge-martin

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 3:13 pm 

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I haven't read any of the books, but am very much enjoying the show.

Curious--how does the show's treatment of the passage of time compare with the book's? It seems to be inconsistent in the show in terms of how long passes within an episode. Is it the same way in the chapters of the first book? It's hard to keep up sometimes with how long its been since we started out, but maybe I wouldn't have that problem if I read the book(s).


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 4:19 pm 
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Iron Krullet wrote:
I haven't read any of the books, but am very much enjoying the show.

Curious--how does the show's treatment of the passage of time compare with the book's? It seems to be inconsistent in the show in terms of how long passes within an episode. Is it the same way in the chapters of the first book? It's hard to keep up sometimes with how long its been since we started out, but maybe I wouldn't have that problem if I read the book(s).


I wouldn't say there is any obvious timeline in the books, but the author does a good job with flowing the story around the various POV characters and the reader gets enough of a sense to understand the chronology without there being an actual display of dates and times.

The show is easy enough to follow for those of us who have read the books, but shit happens fast so I can understand the pacing and scene shifts feeling a little chaotic.


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 4:21 pm 
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Jam8 wrote:
JxDx wrote:
Okay, am I not remembering something in the book or is the Loras - Renly connection a little more intimate than it was written?


Martin has stated that they were lovers but he never had the chance to fully show it because of his structural choices, neither was a Point Of View character so he could only hint at it, there was no way to show it through other characters given the secrecy of the relationship. It's not like anyone else was in the room. He's been saying this for years as readers asked about the comments made by Stannis and Jaime about their relationship in the books, the most direct references to it.

More recent article where he states it, but similar things were said years before the show:
http://www.afterelton.com/tv/2011/01/ga ... rge-martin



I thought I remembered the hint but didn't recall the slightest bit of actual exposition on the real nature of the relationship....thanks for the link!


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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 4:56 pm 
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I don't remember if I read it that way myself, I thought it was more about getting a dig in.

During my re-read I noticed a number of details in A Clash of Kings that hint at it.

It's more of a once you know, you see things that were there but you read in a different way. I won't spoil anything for anyone else, but if you haven't read it...you'll probably catch it quicker now.

And there's one detail that going in knowing they are a gay couple is very funny, and a very obvious obvious hint.

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 Post subject: Re: Song of Ice and Fire HBO series
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 11:34 pm 
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I'm glad they casted Theon Greyjoy nicely as the shallow cruel little fuck that he is later on. Even if he looks like the love child Alex and Dim from A Clockwork Orange.

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